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Author Topic: Red Dog's pit - I finally started  (Read 715825 times)

Offline AiRdAncE

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Red Dog's pit - I finally started
« Reply #525 on: March 18, 2007, 05:17:24 PM »
Quote from: "Red Dog"
I still think it's way less work than soldering 250 backlight leds per cockpit side.

I agree with you on that one ;)

Quote from: "Red Dog"

For me the only real point that drove my decision is the perfect diffusion of the light with Mike's panel. it looks great and it's just perfect

But.... is it life-like ? Aren't the real panels point-lit (with bulbs or LEDs ?)

EDIT: What I meant to say; aren't the real panels point-lit and thus unevenly lit ? Unlike EL panels which are evenly lit ?
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Offline idekkers

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Red Dog's pit - I finally started
« Reply #526 on: March 18, 2007, 05:18:49 PM »
CAT 5 are bulbs, CAT 7 are LEDs.

Ido

Marvin

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Red Dog's pit - I finally started
« Reply #527 on: March 18, 2007, 06:31:31 PM »
Red Dog,

Those are some good and convincing points.

Jody

Offline jethomasjr

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Red Dog's pit - I finally started
« Reply #528 on: March 18, 2007, 11:27:04 PM »
Quote from: "Marvin"
So what are really the pro and cons of this procedure?


So anyone??  What are the real pros and cons of these EL sheets?  Should we go this route, or stick with LEDs?

Jody


Pro's and Con's

Pro: It would really make lighting up the panels so much easier.

Con's: Yes, it does get expensive. I have replaced many panels in aircraft because the EL lighting fizzled out. There has been several instances when I took the broke part off and put on the new one and it wouldn't work. In real world aviation the cost to send them off to get fixed is in the $3-8K range. The EL panel on the start switch panel in a Learjet 30 series which the dimensions are 5 inches by 8 inches cost $4K. I know I am in the wrong business just knowing what the cost is for aircraft parts.

Pro: EL panels just snaps into the plug socket (small round gold socket) and then you reattach with the hardware holding the EL panel onto instrument panel or wherever it may be located in the cockpit. It's basically plug and play and you don't have all the wires hanging around like you would with all LED lights. If you have an original panel look at the back of one and you'll see what I am talking about.

Pro: It would save a lot of headaches and time, but then you have to look at the cost and be willing to spend the money.

I sit and read through all the threads reading the daily progress from everybody. I find it amazing as to how some of you come up with ideas to make things work. Then I go to work and build airplanes and think to myself how or what can I do to help out. In real world aviation I know how and what to do and know where to go for the things I need to do my job. Got to love R&D. You guys are great! And what really amazes me is and I say this because I don't know who has or don't have any aviation background. I know a couple on here don't and they really impress the hell out of me. Keep up the good work guys. Finally got two CNC machines going at work. Now it's finding time. Oh yeah I forgot, I am now back on day shift and have Saturdays and Sundays off, but will work most Saturdays. Got to maintain at least 72 hours a week ya know.


Jack

Offline thebeev

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Red Dog's pit - I finally started
« Reply #529 on: March 20, 2007, 08:00:56 PM »
Con's: Yes it can get expensive, but...

Pro's:  In the long run, once your pit comes together more and more(I know there is never an end in sight) There will be less stuff to buy for the pit, so when you have to get those replaced it won't be so bad.  Plus that part of the pit, not including the MFD solution is probably the most important part.  So I would be more then willing to spend extra on that section.

Offline mihi4

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Red Dog's pit - I finally started
« Reply #530 on: March 21, 2007, 03:47:11 AM »
Quote from: "thebeev"
Plus that part of the pit, not including the MFD solution is probably the most important part.  So I would be more then willing to spend extra on that section.

Ok, here's my opinion on that topic (maybe we should move this part to an extra thread, Mike?). I don't think, that backlighting the panels is in ANY way important. Yes, my panels are ready for it, and "yes", I think about backlighting them. But "NO", there won't be any backlighted panels (maybe one prototype for testing, if time permits), until everything else in the pit, what _REALLY_ is important for flying, is working.

Now, that my pit is an 50% flying stage, I really miss the DED, caution panel and working instruments in my pit while flying. Even if it's pitch black dark in the room, the flood light on the consoles is more then enough to see the switches (not that I'd need it, of course every simbuilder nows the places by heart ;-) ). I never thought "oh, $hit, my panels aren't backlit!"... more often I though "oh, $hit, now I have to switch views just to see what's wrong" or "argh, where's the DED".

My next purchase will be a TrackIR in the next monthes. Once I get it, I want to look to my REAL warning lights and DED, not the ones in the sim...

Just my 2 ?c...

greetings
michi
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Offline Red Dog

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Red Dog's pit - I finally started
« Reply #531 on: March 21, 2007, 05:13:58 AM »
I tend to agree with Michi here, backlight really is not important and it must be the last phase of cockpit development.
But let's face it - it's so good to look at. And after all, the cockpit is not only a tool, it's also an object we cherish and find nice.

Everytime I go in my pitroom (which is still the bedroom, unfortunately) I look at the pit and I find it beautiful.
On the other hand, everytime my wife enters the bedroom she finds it ugly, massive and totally out of line  :?

In my case, the pit is 85% complete (DED, PFD, RWR, all F4 switches, speedbrake, chaff and flares counter, all pit lights, floodlights,...) as I wanted it to be. The 15% remaining are the lack of working instrument solution and the lack of backlight.

I'm working on the instruments, but finding a decent TFT to go into the center console is not easy. In the meantime, I use a workaround with a second screen and the excellent F4gauges.

So the last phase of the cockpit will be to enable the backlight.

Michi, the TIR is a blast, I just recently started using it and although I do turn it off for cockpit ramp starts, in game it's terrific. I don't know how I could fly without it for so long.

Have a bandit day
Red Dog

Offline mihi4

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Red Dog's pit - I finally started
« Reply #532 on: March 21, 2007, 07:52:21 AM »
Quote from: "Red Dog"
But let's face it - it's so good to look at. And after all, the cockpit is not only a tool, it's also an object we cherish and find nice.

FULL ACK!
Just before the first time when I had working switches and some lights working, I would have gone the direct route to backlighting the new panels.
But once I did some flying with the working things, I realized, what _REALLY_ is missing, so I'm going to do these things first.

Quote
So the last phase of the cockpit will be to enable the backlight.

Jup, mine, too...

Quote
Michi, the TIR is a blast, I just recently started using it and although I do turn it off for cockpit ramp starts, in game it's terrific. I don't know how I could fly without it for so long.

Yeah, I only heard good things about it. After I tried to do some missile defending, I knew that I HAD to get one...

greetings
michi
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Offline mihi4

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Red Dog's pit - I finally started
« Reply #533 on: March 21, 2007, 07:53:31 AM »
Quote from: "Red Dog"
Michi, the TIR is a blast, I just recently started using it and although I do turn it off for cockpit ramp starts...

Why's that?
Michi "MiHi" Hirczy
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Offline Red Dog

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Red Dog's pit - I finally started
« Reply #534 on: March 21, 2007, 09:19:52 AM »
Well, obviously, I don't need the F4cockpit view to follow my head since I don't pan the F4 cockpit.  :D
I just flip my real switches and don't even look at the F4cockpit which usually stays in the down view so I can keep a look on the MFD (only part not implemented in the pit)

Once ready to taxi, I switch on my position lights to steady (to tell the flight lead I'm ready) and switch to 3D pit and activates the TIR

Have a bandit day
Red Dog

Offline mihi4

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Red Dog's pit - I finally started
« Reply #535 on: March 21, 2007, 10:01:38 AM »
Quote from: "Red Dog"
Well, obviously, I don't need the F4cockpit view to follow my head since I don't pan the F4 cockpit.  :D
I just flip my real switches and don't even look at the F4cockpit which usually stays in the down view so I can keep a look on the MFD (only part not implemented in the pit)

Once ready to taxi, I switch on my position lights to steady (to tell the flight lead I'm ready) and switch to 3D pit and activates the TIR


Ahh, ok... so it's the same procedure like I'm doing :-)
I thought, it's some sort of voodoo to prevent some bug ;-).
I think I'd prefer TIR in 3D-pit only, too.

greetings
michi
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Marvin

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Red Dog's pit - I finally started
« Reply #536 on: March 21, 2007, 11:30:03 AM »
Red Dog,

That is funny...  Cause while I was in Afghanistan, I spent a lot of time watching the Dutch Viper Det, and they were the opposite..  During startup they had their wing/fuselage lights on steady, and once the chalks were removed they went to flash..  I guess it is different for every unit, however they decide to write their SOPs.

Jody

Quote from: "Red Dog"
Well, obviously, I don't need the F4cockpit view to follow my head since I don't pan the F4 cockpit.  :D
I just flip my real switches and don't even look at the F4cockpit which usually stays in the down view so I can keep a look on the MFD (only part not implemented in the pit)

Once ready to taxi, I switch on my position lights to steady (to tell the flight lead I'm ready) and switch to 3D pit and activates the TIR

Offline Red Dog

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Red Dog's pit - I finally started
« Reply #537 on: March 21, 2007, 12:56:32 PM »
yep, there's also a rule that says flashing lights on the ground = pilot in trouble :)

it's just the SOP we apply in our squad.  8)

Have a bandit day
Red Dog

Marvin

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Red Dog's pit - I finally started
« Reply #538 on: March 21, 2007, 05:22:46 PM »
RD,

Really??  I like the one better where the pilot starts freaking out and jettisons his canopy..  That is usually a better sign he is in trouble.  :lol:

Jody

Offline Boomer

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Red Dog's pit - I finally started
« Reply #539 on: March 21, 2007, 05:39:31 PM »
Jody, you crack me up! :lol:

B
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